Asked by the Customer on 14-08-2016 10:34:24
Question posted in the General Law category relating to Gauteng
Question posted in the General Law category relating to Gauteng
Good day
Hoping this message finds you well
I am the oldest daughter of a second marriage. My parents are currently separated because my father beat my mother and threw her out of our family home ( My parents are married in community of property and both my mother and father are on the dead to the house). my parents have been barried since 2006 they are still married but my mother is living elswherewith my younger brother (16 yrs old). The violent incident happend 17 December 2015 and since them my mom has applied for a protection order. What had happened on the 17/12/2015 was that my father's mistress had called the landline in our family house, my mother intercepted the call and was upset and told my fathers misstres not to call that number cause she was paying that telkom account and she did not giv her that number to use and abuse. Connie ( the misstress0 then proceeded to antagonise and irritate my mom and she became upset and began to rais her voice and use profane language, this was then audible to the rest of the house and my father then came to the main bedroom where the landline phone sits and dropped the phone and began to scould my mom and told her she had no right to speak to his misstress in that way, he then slapped my mom and she ran down the passage and out of the house, my dad chased her , my younger sister followed them outside the house to the front yard to get between them and try stop my father from beating our mom, my farther then slapped my younger sister across the face twice, the second slap resulted in my little sister falling to the ground. As people passed by because this was happening in the front yard my father then became aware of ashamed and told my littlesiter to get into the house , my father then locked the door behind him an prceeded to lock the back door aswell leaveing my mom outside in her pijamers. My father then announced to my little sister and little brother that our mother was never to set foot in the house again and that she was no longer welcome. My younger siblings then packed a bag for my mom and got her car keys through the bathroom window and she was able to leave. my younger siblings then called me and asked to come to JHB to visit me cause I work iand live in Randburg. My dad was more than happy to leave Modimolle where our family house is located and where all the drama happened and drop off my sibligs. 2 blocks away from my house my dad tells my siblings to get out of the car and that he was in a rush somewhere, as my little siter was about to explain that it was 2 blocks away he told them to "fucking get out"with is the usual verbal abuse we have endured over the years and they got out on the corner of the street with their bags and walked up 2 blocks and got to my gate safe. The violent incident on the 17/12/2015 was not hte first of its kind. A similar incident happened during 2008 where the misstres called the landline late at night and demanded to speak with my father, my mom got upset and spoke to Connie to tell her this was inappropriate and to call my dad on his cell phone if he need to speak to him and if he was ignoring her then she should get the message, my father grabber the phone out of my moms hads and ended the call. The next morning my mom called my fathers aunt to tell of the events that occured the night before and my father smashed my moms cell phone and chased her into the kitchen and tackled her to the ground, after hearing her screams I ran to the kitchen to get between them and stop my dad, when I was between them my father has a brick that kept the kitchen door from slamming and he held it to our heads and said that if it was not for me that he would have killed her, he put the brick down and my mom made us get ready for school. Through out the marriage there has been abuse physical, verbal , mental and emotional , to us the kids and my mom, though we tried to tell her to go to the police she was scared and emmbarresed so she never went to the policetill now.
My mom has now applied for a protection order against my dad and had a family meeting and was able to get her clothes and things from the house. my father is now contesting the protection order and claimimg my mom is trying to taint his "dignity", so the court has an interm protection order in place while the case in in court. So far my mom and da have had witnesses in court to testify including my little sister who was present fot the incident on the 17/12/2015 and gave a damning testimony about the events that occured, so much so that my father told her outside of court that "you are a fucking baster and you not my daughter anymore". So this whole time my parents haave not involved lawyers until now, since i work and study it has been hard for me to take time off work to come and testify and also get a date that agrees with a date where a court is available. So finally I got time and my father shows us to court with a lawyer only now towards the end of the case where I'm the only one who needs to give testimony, so asked the judge on the 11th August 2016 ( the date we all agreed on including my father) why is that I need to be delayed more as the judge said she would not allow this lawyer to recall all the other witnesses why is it that I need to be questioned by a lawyer, she did not give me a real or straight answer , but that i need to show up on the 21st September 2016 so that this lawyer can have time and go through the files and records of the case.
Please advice me on:
1) how do i get compensated for my travel and time taken off from work( we have requested the appointment letter of the lawyer who is inconveniencing us to show he had all the time to request the files and go through them and pick up from the 11th August).
2) how should my mother proceed, should she get her own lawayer ( my mother is a school teacher, as compared to my father who can afford to continue a long drawn out and expensive case0
3) what questions can we expect from this lwayer, how can we prepare for the line of questioning on the 21st September?
THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND ASSITANCE IN THIS REGARD
SINCERILY
UNATHI MABITSELA
Hoping this message finds you well
I am the oldest daughter of a second marriage. My parents are currently separated because my father beat my mother and threw her out of our family home ( My parents are married in community of property and both my mother and father are on the dead to the house). my parents have been barried since 2006 they are still married but my mother is living elswherewith my younger brother (16 yrs old). The violent incident happend 17 December 2015 and since them my mom has applied for a protection order. What had happened on the 17/12/2015 was that my father's mistress had called the landline in our family house, my mother intercepted the call and was upset and told my fathers misstres not to call that number cause she was paying that telkom account and she did not giv her that number to use and abuse. Connie ( the misstress0 then proceeded to antagonise and irritate my mom and she became upset and began to rais her voice and use profane language, this was then audible to the rest of the house and my father then came to the main bedroom where the landline phone sits and dropped the phone and began to scould my mom and told her she had no right to speak to his misstress in that way, he then slapped my mom and she ran down the passage and out of the house, my dad chased her , my younger sister followed them outside the house to the front yard to get between them and try stop my father from beating our mom, my farther then slapped my younger sister across the face twice, the second slap resulted in my little sister falling to the ground. As people passed by because this was happening in the front yard my father then became aware of ashamed and told my littlesiter to get into the house , my father then locked the door behind him an prceeded to lock the back door aswell leaveing my mom outside in her pijamers. My father then announced to my little sister and little brother that our mother was never to set foot in the house again and that she was no longer welcome. My younger siblings then packed a bag for my mom and got her car keys through the bathroom window and she was able to leave. my younger siblings then called me and asked to come to JHB to visit me cause I work iand live in Randburg. My dad was more than happy to leave Modimolle where our family house is located and where all the drama happened and drop off my sibligs. 2 blocks away from my house my dad tells my siblings to get out of the car and that he was in a rush somewhere, as my little siter was about to explain that it was 2 blocks away he told them to "fucking get out"with is the usual verbal abuse we have endured over the years and they got out on the corner of the street with their bags and walked up 2 blocks and got to my gate safe. The violent incident on the 17/12/2015 was not hte first of its kind. A similar incident happened during 2008 where the misstres called the landline late at night and demanded to speak with my father, my mom got upset and spoke to Connie to tell her this was inappropriate and to call my dad on his cell phone if he need to speak to him and if he was ignoring her then she should get the message, my father grabber the phone out of my moms hads and ended the call. The next morning my mom called my fathers aunt to tell of the events that occured the night before and my father smashed my moms cell phone and chased her into the kitchen and tackled her to the ground, after hearing her screams I ran to the kitchen to get between them and stop my dad, when I was between them my father has a brick that kept the kitchen door from slamming and he held it to our heads and said that if it was not for me that he would have killed her, he put the brick down and my mom made us get ready for school. Through out the marriage there has been abuse physical, verbal , mental and emotional , to us the kids and my mom, though we tried to tell her to go to the police she was scared and emmbarresed so she never went to the policetill now.
My mom has now applied for a protection order against my dad and had a family meeting and was able to get her clothes and things from the house. my father is now contesting the protection order and claimimg my mom is trying to taint his "dignity", so the court has an interm protection order in place while the case in in court. So far my mom and da have had witnesses in court to testify including my little sister who was present fot the incident on the 17/12/2015 and gave a damning testimony about the events that occured, so much so that my father told her outside of court that "you are a fucking baster and you not my daughter anymore". So this whole time my parents haave not involved lawyers until now, since i work and study it has been hard for me to take time off work to come and testify and also get a date that agrees with a date where a court is available. So finally I got time and my father shows us to court with a lawyer only now towards the end of the case where I'm the only one who needs to give testimony, so asked the judge on the 11th August 2016 ( the date we all agreed on including my father) why is that I need to be delayed more as the judge said she would not allow this lawyer to recall all the other witnesses why is it that I need to be questioned by a lawyer, she did not give me a real or straight answer , but that i need to show up on the 21st September 2016 so that this lawyer can have time and go through the files and records of the case.
Please advice me on:
1) how do i get compensated for my travel and time taken off from work( we have requested the appointment letter of the lawyer who is inconveniencing us to show he had all the time to request the files and go through them and pick up from the 11th August).
2) how should my mother proceed, should she get her own lawayer ( my mother is a school teacher, as compared to my father who can afford to continue a long drawn out and expensive case0
3) what questions can we expect from this lwayer, how can we prepare for the line of questioning on the 21st September?
THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND ASSITANCE IN THIS REGARD
SINCERILY
UNATHI MABITSELA
Message from the Attorney
Posted by Att. Patrick on 14-08-2016 11:17:57
Hi there and thank you for your question,
I'm really sorry to hear your story, but I can confirm that your mother is following the right course of actions in applying for a domestic violence protection order. It's the right thing to do, and based on what you've explained above the Magistrate should make the interim protection order final.
To answer your questions:-
Re: 1) You unfortunately can't get compensation for the travel and time taken off work. The court sees you testifying as your "duty" to come to court and testify on behalf of the parties.
Re: 2) Yes, your mother should get her own attorney to either (a) have a look at the file so far and give advice; or (b) to represent her in court similar to your dad's attorney. The reason I'm saying this is because your dad's lawyer could use some rules of court against your mother to challenge certain evidence, or such like, in an attempt to have the case thrown out. Without lawyers involved the Magistrate has a wide discretion to make whatever order he/she wants. With lawyers involved, the Magistrate is more caution.
Re: 3) I honestly don't know what specific questions you can expect, but in general the questions will be aimed at discrediting your mom's story in general. They will probably be phrased in such a way as to suggest that your mom was the abusive one in the relationship, and your father was just defending himself - or something like that. Regarding the brick incident, the questions will be aimed at saying "Isn't it possible that he was going to use the brick to secure the back door", instead of "using the brick to assault your mother". You guys need to be strong on the answers, and you need to be truthful, and explain "what you thought in the moment". Don't allow yourselves to change your answers. Say how you felt at the time, say what you thought at the time. Don't let the lawyer push you into giving certain answers. Be strong.
If your mother hires an attorney then the attorney can also assist in "protecting" you all from certain questions. They will know what to object to, and such like.
You should also remember that all evidence is necessary, so testify as to what your dad said outside of the court room as well.
Also remember that the Magistrate could order your dad to leave the common home and move out because of the protection order! That's what your mom should push for - then apply for a divorce!
If there is a part of the answer which you need more advice on, or clarity please continue in this same thread instead of opening a new question.
Att. Patrick
Please remember this is a dialog if you have follow up questions please use the REPLY button and ask. If I did not answer the question you thought you were asking, please respond with the specific question you wanted answered. I hope you found my answer helpful, and you have finished asking your questions, please click on the GREEN ACCEPT button in order to mark the question as closed.
I'm really sorry to hear your story, but I can confirm that your mother is following the right course of actions in applying for a domestic violence protection order. It's the right thing to do, and based on what you've explained above the Magistrate should make the interim protection order final.
To answer your questions:-
Re: 1) You unfortunately can't get compensation for the travel and time taken off work. The court sees you testifying as your "duty" to come to court and testify on behalf of the parties.
Re: 2) Yes, your mother should get her own attorney to either (a) have a look at the file so far and give advice; or (b) to represent her in court similar to your dad's attorney. The reason I'm saying this is because your dad's lawyer could use some rules of court against your mother to challenge certain evidence, or such like, in an attempt to have the case thrown out. Without lawyers involved the Magistrate has a wide discretion to make whatever order he/she wants. With lawyers involved, the Magistrate is more caution.
Re: 3) I honestly don't know what specific questions you can expect, but in general the questions will be aimed at discrediting your mom's story in general. They will probably be phrased in such a way as to suggest that your mom was the abusive one in the relationship, and your father was just defending himself - or something like that. Regarding the brick incident, the questions will be aimed at saying "Isn't it possible that he was going to use the brick to secure the back door", instead of "using the brick to assault your mother". You guys need to be strong on the answers, and you need to be truthful, and explain "what you thought in the moment". Don't allow yourselves to change your answers. Say how you felt at the time, say what you thought at the time. Don't let the lawyer push you into giving certain answers. Be strong.
If your mother hires an attorney then the attorney can also assist in "protecting" you all from certain questions. They will know what to object to, and such like.
You should also remember that all evidence is necessary, so testify as to what your dad said outside of the court room as well.
Also remember that the Magistrate could order your dad to leave the common home and move out because of the protection order! That's what your mom should push for - then apply for a divorce!
If there is a part of the answer which you need more advice on, or clarity please continue in this same thread instead of opening a new question.
Att. Patrick
Please remember this is a dialog if you have follow up questions please use the REPLY button and ask. If I did not answer the question you thought you were asking, please respond with the specific question you wanted answered. I hope you found my answer helpful, and you have finished asking your questions, please click on the GREEN ACCEPT button in order to mark the question as closed.
Message from the Customer
with regards to the magistrate ordering my dad to move out of the common house, does my mom have to request this in court, and how do we make sure my dad continues to pay rates and taxes and other bills concerning the property ? Also will i be good for he case once we get the appointment letter for m dad's lawyer o show ha he are wasting time on purpose or is i no worth the fight?
Message from the Attorney
Posted by Att. Patrick on 14-08-2016 17:57:42
Q: with regards to the magistrate ordering my dad to move out of the common house, does my mom have to request this in court --> Your mom would need to explain that she was living at the house before she fled for her life, and she wants to live there again. Then, the Magistrate must be asked to ensure that the protection order states that your dad is not allowed within 100m of your mom, and that he must vacate the house.
Q: how do we make sure my dad continues to pay rates and taxes and other bills concerning the property? --> There is unfortunately no real way to do this. This might mean that your mom might need to pay some of these bills, otherwise the City / Municipality might cut off the services, or might try to attach the house to settle any arrears. Otherwise, your mom must apply for a divorce and then request interim maintenance, and then ask that your dad be ordered to pay the rates and taxes until the divorce is finalised.
Q: Also will i be good for he case once we get the appointment letter for m dad's lawyer o show ha he are wasting time on purpose or is i no worth the fight? --> Not too sure what you're actually asking, but there isn't any real point in geting letters about delay tactics. Everyone is entitled to legal representation, and cases are often postponed for months at a time to allow this to happen. It's just the way of South African courts - probably the whole world's courts!
Q: how do we make sure my dad continues to pay rates and taxes and other bills concerning the property? --> There is unfortunately no real way to do this. This might mean that your mom might need to pay some of these bills, otherwise the City / Municipality might cut off the services, or might try to attach the house to settle any arrears. Otherwise, your mom must apply for a divorce and then request interim maintenance, and then ask that your dad be ordered to pay the rates and taxes until the divorce is finalised.
Q: Also will i be good for he case once we get the appointment letter for m dad's lawyer o show ha he are wasting time on purpose or is i no worth the fight? --> Not too sure what you're actually asking, but there isn't any real point in geting letters about delay tactics. Everyone is entitled to legal representation, and cases are often postponed for months at a time to allow this to happen. It's just the way of South African courts - probably the whole world's courts!
Message from the Customer
Lastly I wanted to find out, when I'm on the stand do I have to answer the questions posed to me by my father's lawyer ?
Message from the Attorney
Posted by Att. Patrick on 29-08-2016 11:04:41
Yes, unfortunately you will need to answer all of the questions posed by your father's lawyer. One of the reasons why you might want to hire your own lawyer (or at least get your mom to hire a lawyer) is to object to certain questions, so as to protect you!
Answer Accepted
This answer was accepted on 30-08-2016 07:20:30
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